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Bluddy 02-12-2011 12:34 PM

Examining character modifiers
 
Hey guys

When I first saw all the character modifiers that are available, I was flabbergasted. But then I found that almost every time I start a new character, I read over them and say to myself: "Naah, that doesn't seem fun. Nope, I don't feel like doing that." I'd like to get your feedback on these modifiers and see if we can come up with suggestions to make them more intereseting/practical. Here are my reactions to the different modifiers:

- Hardcore: death is final, no shared stash. This one's cool and I get why people like it. I may make a few of these characters one day, but right now the 'loss of time' doesn't seem worth it.
- Cursed: also seems interesting, mostly because it gives cursed items a huge role. Normally I throw away cursed items since there are so many magical items that I know I'll get something better pretty soon.
- Ego: less experience on lower levels. Also seems pretty neat.
- Unlucky: Fewer magic items. As of right now, I think this is probably one of the best options.
- Honorable death: die if the town is destroyed. I don't really get this one. If I'm not playing hardcore, it does nothing, and if I'm playing hardcore, it makes it even harder (as if that's needed). Maybe it's meant to make semi-hardcore harder?
My suggestion: change it to lose 4/5 vitality if a town is destroyed.
- Semi-hardcore: Lose 5 vitality every time you die. I've written about it elsewhere -- I think it's too much. You can survive the first town of your character since the monsters can barely touch you in the low single digit levels, but after that, 5 vitality/death means that a non-defensive character effectively has about 3-4 'lives', which it can try to extend with vitality potions. Not that practical.
My suggestion: change it to 1-2 vitality loss per death.
- Poverty: less money and items. Sounds great and challenging.
- Fragile: Half the health. Sounds a little boring and may only be for defensive characters, but could be challenging.
- Clumsy: half the dexterity. Same reaction. How does it work? Do you just start out with lower dexterity? When you put points into dexterity, do only 1/2 go in?
- Lost: no map. Can't see anyone using this unless they go with very slow pace and lower levels.
- Prima Donna: can't use non-special items. Since there are so many special (magical/unique) items, and since the first town is easy, this would be very easy to do. Almost all my gear is magical.
- Only hope: you die, the town dies. I guess this is like a lighter hardcore, except who want to lose towns so fast?
My suggestion: change it to 'you die -- the dungeon gets much more aggressive'.
- Hunger: have to eat. Definitely want to try this one out. It could be interesting but could also get annoying. Since food is such a relatively cheap and useful resource, you use lots of it anyway, so I can't see this making a massive difference gameplay-wise, except for healing characters who are now forced to eat regardless.

Feedback on any of these?

Caal 02-12-2011 02:57 PM

Hardcore - absolutely my favorite. I play this mode most of the time.

Cursed - I've tried this a few times and tried hard to like this mode, but I just don't.

Ego - Good for people who consistently play at dungeon levels higher than their characters, but for more conservative players, getting half xp most of the time is frustrating.

Unlucky is a nice option, but I prefer modding the item code to customize the quantity and quality of drops to my liking.

Poverty - Tried this a few times, but with not that much to spend money on, characters often still generate more than enough cash.

Semi-hardcore - death makes the character weaker and weaker until the ultimate death. Haven't tried it but seems frustrating. I would have preferred a system where you start with one life then gain an additional life (kind of a Din's blessing thing) say every x levels, or one or more lives with each gain in status (freedom, champion, elite, etc).

Hunger - Haven't tried this, but I have played enough roguelikes to know what it's like. There, foods are often hard to find, and staying well nourished can be very difficult. Since foods are readily available in Din's, I can't see this being much of a challenge.

Lost - I've tried this a couple of times, and again I think roguelike experience helps here. If you "wall hug" and move around in one direction you should do ok.

Max_Powers 02-12-2011 04:35 PM

Truth is, I rarely if ever use any of these. I usually(depending on individual character)play on normal settings with the exception of 'Dangerous Monsters' and sometimes fast pace.

The semi-hardcore setting seems interesting, but also kind of counter-intuitive to the overall theme of the game. I mean, Din wants you to succeed, therefore why would there be penalties for death?

Bluddy 02-12-2011 05:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Max_Powers (Post 22190)
The semi-hardcore setting seems interesting, but also kind of counter-intuitive to the overall theme of the game. I mean, Din wants you to succeed, therefore why would there be penalties for death?

We can always make up reasons. Maybe resurrection is so traumatic it weakens the soul, and beyond a certain point it can't be done anymore, even by a god.

Max_Powers 02-12-2011 05:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bluddy (Post 22192)
We can always make up reasons. Maybe resurrection is so traumatic it weakens the soul, and beyond a certain point it can't be done anymore, even by a god.

True that! Never looked at it that way I guess.

Tar Palantir 02-12-2011 08:00 PM

I don't have time to check it right now but isn't prima donna just Legendary, artifact, unique and set items?

(play a hardcore character with that option on: there is THE challenge, as there is no shared stash)

DeathKnight1728 02-12-2011 09:26 PM

Bluddy said-
- Clumsy: half the dexterity. Same reaction. How does it work? Do you just start out with lower dexterity? When you put points into dexterity, do only 1/2 go in?


Clumsy works like this-if you have 10 dexterity normally, you will only have-5. It makes it very hard to play unless you have a high amount of dexterity. Try playing this with a squishy character that has low dexterity mod and you will have to pump it extra into it.

Ive said this before and ill say it again-modifiers should be like optional traits from original fallout-you get an advantage and a disadvantage. I dont know what to choose for each but that is up to shadow. Otherwise there is no reason to pick them. The game is already hard as anything as it is. Hardcore, cursed, hunger and only hope would be the only ones i would choose.

Bluddy 02-13-2011 12:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DeathKnight1728 (Post 22200)
Ive said this before and ill say it again-modifiers should be like optional traits from original fallout-you get an advantage and a disadvantage. I dont know what to choose for each but that is up to shadow. Otherwise there is no reason to pick them. The game is already hard as anything as it is. Hardcore, cursed, hunger and only hope would be the only ones i would choose.

That's a really good point. I think there's a huge difference between those of us who are 'amateurs' and have only played until a certain level (mid 20s for me) and those who played all the way. You guys really appreciate the difficulty of the game as is. I wish there were more people who got close to 100 to give feedback on the late game balancing.

Right now, the only reward for choosing these modifiers is a bit more XP, but you're right -- give the difficulty of the game, it does make more sense to go the fallout way.

Bak 02-13-2011 01:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bluddy (Post 22210)
Right now, the only reward for choosing these modifiers is a bit more XP, but you're right -- give the difficulty of the game, it does make more sense to go the fallout way.

There is a bonus to XP? That's true for town modifiers (like fast), but I don't think there is anything for character mods, beyond a boost to the clicker's ego. :D

Bluddy 02-14-2011 03:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bak (Post 22227)
There is a bonus to XP? That's true for town modifiers (like fast), but I don't think there is anything for character mods, beyond a boost to the clicker's ego. :D

My mistake, you're absolutely right. Got confused with town modifiers.


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