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  #11  
Old 07-02-2012, 08:05 PM
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There is code that makes them turn on each other. It is possible that there are hidden races still. In the next build there will be a way to know if there are hidden races left.
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  #12  
Old 07-02-2012, 10:35 PM
jerebaldo1 jerebaldo1 is offline
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I too can confirm this unwinnable state in a normal/medium/6 race game; I traipsed all around the galaxy looking for other races, and the 3 others that weren't allied in a love triangle were all eliminated. Something isn't activating that code; sure seems like the more common class of bug during development of A Valley Without Wind
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  #13  
Old 07-02-2012, 10:39 PM
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I find myself allied with the Brunt against the Utopians, who are more than twice as powerful as my ally. I didn't make contact with the Utopians for quite some time. Hours spent picking off Utopian planets- and by picking off, I mean staying out of range and cheesing with bombs- has made no perceptible difference. In fact, the tide continues to swing in favor of the Utopians.

I don't have the power to wage war in any way meaningful enough to help my allies. I don't stand a chance in a direct confrontation with an enemy planet. At this point, I could abandon my allies and start grinding relations with the Utopians, but that feels like defeat, too. Maybe, I just haven't figured out how to wage war effectively.

The thought that keeps occurring to me is that I don't have the opportunity to make a meaningful choice as to who I ally with. If I were to start by scouring the sector for every race, at least I would have some idea which race to side with. The most powerful race. As far as achieving a winning sector goes, doing quests for anyone else is effectively counterproductive. Why build any race up, do any questing, sign any treaties or offer so much as a crumb, when I will be coming back to destroy them? Wouldn't destroying any race on sight be the most effective strategy? Until the last one left is lucky enough to be my ally and ticket to victory.

If this victory condition is to continue, I feel like we need full contact with every species at the start of the game. Allow the players a choice about who to throw in with besides who the closest race is. And the closest race is my chosen ally 90% of the time, simply by virtue of me needing to trade with someone and have safe harbor.

Or, set up the game so that each sector is a contract with a specific race. The Brunt have hired a Drox Operative to come in and help them conquer the sector. It makes sense with the current win condition, at the cost of some of the sandbox feel.

The sole survivor win condition feels brutal to me. I enjoyed the idea of forging alliances between the species and creating harmony via laser blasts. At the least, allow a surrender option so that I'm not playing the game of genocide every time.

Geez, I feel like I'm whining now.
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  #14  
Old 07-03-2012, 12:55 AM
Shadowy Figure Shadowy Figure is offline
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I just lost a game where I had a mutual protection pact with the Hive and I was taking out the Dryads one planet at a time. After destroying a couple Dryad colonies, the Hive and Dryads signed a mutual protection pact. One more destroyed Dryad colony later, they formed an alliance. The Hive declared war on me then the 10 minute lose timer started ticking.

Quote:
Originally Posted by RoboAV View Post
If I were to start by scouring the sector for every race, at least I would have some idea which race to side with. The most powerful race.
After I first installed the game I watched the intro video then just assumed that is exactly how you are supposed to play the game. Did you skip the video or did you have an entirely different impression than I did?
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  #15  
Old 07-03-2012, 02:36 AM
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I re-watched the intro video to see if I had missed anything. It seems to me that the point of the intro is quite the opposite, really.
"They learned that loyalty to any one race was foolish."
Yet, loyalty to one race is the victory condition...

The Drox have lost there way, again. Is history doomed to repeat itself?

Last edited by RoboAV : 07-03-2012 at 02:41 AM. Reason: continue my thought. With added hyperbole.
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  #16  
Old 07-03-2012, 02:57 AM
LostSoul LostSoul is offline
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Well, once all the planets were claimed in the sector the two races finally turned on one another. We'll see how this ends I guess. I'm not seeing much hope for the underdogs here though cause they are...tiny compared to the big sector spanning super-power.
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  #17  
Old 07-03-2012, 07:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jerebaldo1 View Post
I too can confirm this unwinnable state in a normal/medium/6 race game; I traipsed all around the galaxy looking for other races, and the 3 others that weren't allied in a love triangle were all eliminated. Something isn't activating that code; sure seems like the more common class of bug during development of A Valley Without Wind
Yeah the code is not activating, not even with the .906 patch. I cannot win this game, I just fly around aimlessly killing stuff that is level 5, and I have explored every inch of every system. These last two remaining races have a strong love for each other that is unbreakable.

I have tried going to war with the weaker race, but they just blast me to bits in seconds because their ships are 10 times more powerful than mine, and I have no chance to make myself any stronger than they are when quests only give me about 160 XP on top of all the mobs being half my level. I did notice that there were about 2 or 3 un-colonized planets in the game, but they are all gas giants and nobody seems very interested. Could that be keeping them from turning on each other?

I dunno, I guess I will just have to start a new ship, and hope this doesn't happen again...
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  #18  
Old 07-03-2012, 09:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Heffro View Post
Yeah the code is not activating, not even with the .906 patch. I cannot win this game, I just fly around aimlessly killing stuff that is level 5, and I have explored every inch of every system. These last two remaining races have a strong love for each other that is unbreakable.
You might want to look at the win progress screen and see if there are any hidden races somewhere.
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  #19  
Old 07-03-2012, 11:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shadow View Post
You might want to look at the win progress screen and see if there are any hidden races somewhere.
I did that, I went to the "Win Progress" button and it says "Any uknown races left?: No."

Since my last post, I started a new game and the same thing is happening all over again.

I mean, I would gladly blast the weaker race into next week if I could, in fact I would personally prefer to do that for the win, but they level faster than me, have better equipment, and have more ships. I don't stand a chance.
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  #20  
Old 07-04-2012, 07:09 AM
jamuelscones jamuelscones is offline
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I'd like to report that after patching to .906 and playing my deadlocked game for an hour or so, my final two races (Dryad and Hive) are still allied with no signs of that changing. I have checked the new victory progress screen and there are no unknown races left.

Steven - could you explain what is supposed to happen at this stage? Are the two remaining allies just meant to immediately break it off and go to war, or is there supposed to be any kind of escalation that would be visible to the player? I have noticed that there will rarely be a message to the effect that "race X's diplomat has insulted race Y", but the effects of that are quickly reversed by the AI's business-as-usual activity, as is the case with the effects of rumours.

Happy to submit my savegame when I return home from work, if it would help at all.
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