Soldak Home   Drox Operative   Din's Curse   Depths of Peril   Zombasite  

Go Back   Soldak Entertainment Forums > Din's Curse > Din's Curse modding
Register FAQ Members List Calendar Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 11-15-2011, 11:51 AM
Bluddy Bluddy is offline
Legend
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 2,004
Default Monster levels

Shadow, I've noticed 2 things about monster levels that I'm curious about:

1. Monsters of the same archetype are usually spread out over a fairly small range of levels. Type levels of, say, 6,8,9,11,17 is a common spread. Was there a reason for such a small spread vs. spreading them out more fully over the game e.g. 6, 15, 28, 35, 52?
2. Some monsters, such as totems, have a minlevel of 12 and a maxlevel of 30, but they appear on much higher levels and have corresponding HP. How does that work?
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 11-17-2011, 11:10 AM
Shadow's Avatar
Shadow Shadow is offline
Super Moderator
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Dallas, TX
Posts: 9,122
Default

The levels you are seeing are essentially restricted to between 1 and 30 because in higher difficulty levels the level will automatically get bumped up by that difficulty's minimum level. So a monster that normally has levels of 6,8,9,11, and 17 will be 31, 33, 34, 36, and 42 in champion difficulty.
__________________
Steven Peeler
Designer/programmer
Depths of Peril, Kivi's Underworld, Din's Curse, Drox Operative, Zombasite, & Din's Legacy
Patreon
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 11-17-2011, 11:53 AM
Bluddy Bluddy is offline
Legend
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 2,004
Default

Oh I see. But what does that mean in terms of monsters in the game? What does it mean then that orc1 is level 1, orc2 is level 5 etc? Does it mean that I'll only start seeing orc2 at level 5, and then once I reach level 25, I won't start seeing orc2's until I get to level 30 ie. does level here mean the minimum level a monsterType can appear in?
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 11-17-2011, 01:44 PM
Shadow's Avatar
Shadow Shadow is offline
Super Moderator
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Dallas, TX
Posts: 9,122
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluddy View Post
Oh I see. But what does that mean in terms of monsters in the game? What does it mean then that orc1 is level 1, orc2 is level 5 etc? Does it mean that I'll only start seeing orc2 at level 5, and then once I reach level 25, I won't start seeing orc2's until I get to level 30 ie. does level here mean the minimum level a monsterType can appear in?
That does mean you will only see that particular orc type at level 5, 30, 55, and 80. The levels can vary a little bit though.
__________________
Steven Peeler
Designer/programmer
Depths of Peril, Kivi's Underworld, Din's Curse, Drox Operative, Zombasite, & Din's Legacy
Patreon
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 11-17-2011, 02:11 PM
Bluddy Bluddy is offline
Legend
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 2,004
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shadow View Post
That does mean you will only see that particular orc type at level 5, 30, 55, and 80. The levels can vary a little bit though.
1. How much can they vary? I've seen a variation of up to 3 I think.
2. What happens with all the types that spawn at levels > 25, which is where the difficulty level switches? Will you only see those types if you keep playing at the lower difficulty level past the switch point, or if you go down to deep dungeon levels at around level 25 towns?
3. How would it affect things if instead of giving exact levels to monster types, I gave ranges? So for example Creeping Brood would be from 5-11 instead of just being 5, and Lurking Brood would be from 11-16 instead of just being 11 etc.
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 11-17-2011, 06:21 PM
Shadow's Avatar
Shadow Shadow is offline
Super Moderator
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Dallas, TX
Posts: 9,122
Default

1) Usually only 1 level down or the same level, except if the level specifies a DesiredMonsterSpawn (then it is -4 to +2). This is all controlled by MinMonsterLevelOffset, MaxMonsterLevelOffset, MinDesiredMonsterLevelOffset, and MaxDesiredMonsterLevelOffset in world.gdb.
2) The starting point switches at level 25 but a normal difficulty world can get to level 30 at the deepest part of the dungeon.
3) In theory it should work, like you said the Totems work like that.
__________________
Steven Peeler
Designer/programmer
Depths of Peril, Kivi's Underworld, Din's Curse, Drox Operative, Zombasite, & Din's Legacy
Patreon
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 11-17-2011, 06:46 PM
Bluddy Bluddy is offline
Legend
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 2,004
Default

Does Max/MinDesiredMonsterLevelOffset affect Min/MaxLevel (like in totems) or does it just affect Level?

Also, if I may ask, what was the reason for staggering monsters over specific levels in this way?

Last edited by Bluddy : 11-17-2011 at 06:50 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 11-17-2011, 07:16 PM
Shadow's Avatar
Shadow Shadow is offline
Super Moderator
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Dallas, TX
Posts: 9,122
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluddy View Post
Does Max/MinDesiredMonsterLevelOffset affect Min/MaxLevel (like in totems) or does it just affect Level?

Also, if I may ask, what was the reason for staggering monsters over specific levels in this way?
It doesn't effect the monster levels exactly, it just controls what level monsters can show up in any specific level.

We stagger monsters so every monster type can't show up in level 1 (or any other specific level) and so we can have low level monsters (Torva) and high level monsters (Chaos Lords).
__________________
Steven Peeler
Designer/programmer
Depths of Peril, Kivi's Underworld, Din's Curse, Drox Operative, Zombasite, & Din's Legacy
Patreon
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 11-18-2011, 08:06 AM
Bluddy Bluddy is offline
Legend
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 2,004
Default

1. What about dimensional gates? They have a range of level 5 to 100. How does that work with the system of adding 25 per difficulty level?
2. How does the availability of monsters at certain levels affect spawn chance calculations? Let's say monster X can't spawn in level 5. Will X's spawnChance be counted when calculating probabilities for level 5, or will it not be counted?
3. I guess I'm confused about how spawning works in general. Here's how I imagine the process to be:
a. NumMonsterTypesToUse monsters are chosen per dungeon level out of the available monsters at that level and using the InitChance of monsters (which is almost always 1).
b. Those monsters are initialized throughout the level given the density desired.
c. Monsters are spawned as they die based on their SpawnChance, from the pool of monsters available at that level without regard for the monsters chosen initially...? (I thought only the 4 monster types chosen could spawn, but then MonsterFog, TemporalFlux etc would never spawn).
Is this the process or am I getting something wrong?

BTW I'm pretty certain there's something wrong with Scree spawning and I can't figure out what it is. They should be spawning almost as commonly as imps, but I almost never see them in the game. I'm not sure if I've ever seen them spawn, and I definitely haven't seen them in the early levels where they're supposed to be.

EDIT: OK figured it out. ArchetypeFiend is missing in world.gdb.

Last edited by Bluddy : 11-18-2011 at 10:18 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 11-18-2011, 11:17 AM
Shadow's Avatar
Shadow Shadow is offline
Super Moderator
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Dallas, TX
Posts: 9,122
Default

1) The range for dimensional gates should probably be 5 to 30 like the totems, although I would guess that 5 to 100 ends up working the same way.
2) Their spawn chance will be ignored in levels that they can't spawn in.
3) It does pick a few initial monster types and sticks to just those types unless a quest forces a new type to be spawned. The reason that you also get things like MonsterFog is because they are specified using ObjectSpawn instead of MonsterSpawn in world.gdb or world2.gdb.

The scree will be fixed in 1.025. I guess everyone gets a new (kind of) monster in the next patch.
__________________
Steven Peeler
Designer/programmer
Depths of Peril, Kivi's Underworld, Din's Curse, Drox Operative, Zombasite, & Din's Legacy
Patreon
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 05:46 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright 2007 - 2019 Soldak Entertainment, Inc.