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  #341  
Old 05-10-2017, 02:36 PM
Ghost Matter Ghost Matter is offline
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Here are some suggestions of mine for the expansion. They're mostly about rebuilding after the zombie apocalypse, thus putting a greater emphasis on both zombies and apocalypse.
  • Rebuilding the town with quests over a long time. Maybe even merchants!
  • Opening new exits from the starting town after clearing a region. You stay in the same region but new clans and locations appear.
  • Possibility to split your (player) clan and create a new one. When it simply becomes too unwieldy and the food upkeep is too high, it allows to split the work. The new clan is automatically allied to you and your other allies.
  • Moving the clan to another town inside the same map. The new location is closer to the current objectives. It would take a lot of Expedition points (or another resource replacing it) though.
  • Helping other clans grow with more than gifts and alliances. Sending them recruits, helping build new houses, merchants, eetc.
  • Freeing new areas from hordes of zombies and helping new clans settle. Newly unlocked areas in a region are fully occupied by hordes of zombies. You need to clear out some space before the zombie threat at the gates is gone. Then after you can clear out space to settle new clans.
  • Getting non-human clan members.
Another idea that links all of those above: a metropolis city for your clan.
  • You have a main city for you clan where there could be merchants, clan members and other "city" features.
  • When you move to a new region, you are actually clearing an area for a new outpost to be established permanently, thus pushing back the zombie threat further away from your main city.
  • Completing quests and accumulating resources in a frontier (or march or outpost) region allows to improve the main city.
  • You can spend some resources to get help from the main city, with certain risks (spies, enemies follow, losing the caravan on the way, etc.)
  • When moving to the new frontier region, you can choose who and what to bring. Unfortunately, you can't bring all the clan/city members. The restriction is based on a certain number of resources accumulated and the upgrades to the city. You can go over the limit but if the city is not well-defended enough, it might take damage or even fall completely.
  • This city could potentially be shared between characters. If so, there could be a much bigger shared stash (the Vault), only available when your character has finished with a region or if you spend resources to get temporary access to the Vault.
  • Keeping the city happy and supplied is essential, else, they could break away and form a competing city/clan!
  • It is possible, and sometimes necessary, to revisit cleared regions as a new enemy has appeared or another clan/city is trying to lay claim to its resources.
  • The city also has a "job/quest board" where you can select the next region to visit with different objectives/victory conditions that possibly rewards a non-random object.
  • If the main victory condition is not attainable anymore (for example, the other clans destroyed so no diplomatic victory is possible), you can still gain rewards for the region but they are not as great (bronze vs gold chest or no non-random reward).
  • The addition of a main victory condition could potentially change the gameplay in a region a lot. For example, if the condition is "a diplomatic victory while allied to the Collectors", being at war with the collectors would something to avoid or fix. Right now, there isn't really any incentive not to destroy a clan you're at war with, even with the friends bonuses.
  • The non-random reward is an encouragement to the player to play those quest board regions. If the player really wants the unique Axe, they might have to choose a more intimidating region. The item is automatically level-adjusted when it is given to the player.
  • It is still possible to customize the regions' levels. It is also still possible to create a new region the "classic" way. The rewards are as good as the regions on the quest board but are random.
Alternatively, the player clan could not be responsible for a city, but be more like a mercenary, similar to Drox Operative:
  • Clearing new regions improves relations with the city you give it to or chose the quest from.
  • Other clans are trying to win regions before you (optional) and give them to cities, preferably ones who don't like you.
  • Visiting the cities is still possible between adventures. And sometimes required when a new threat emerges, outside or in the city!
Even with all this, playing the "classic" Zombasite should still be possible, especially if the new mechanics demand more in terms of system requirements.


Seems like I wrote a lot! This is definitely outside the scope of this expansion but it might give some useful ideas.

Last edited by Ghost Matter : 05-11-2017 at 01:40 AM. Reason: typos
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  #342  
Old 05-10-2017, 09:22 PM
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Destro* Destro* is offline
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Really cool ideas Ghost Matter. I feel that all of those changes could be classified under 'world management'. A greater emphasis on controlling and developing areas, managing relations and fighting against a tangible threat. I almost feel that with such mechanics, the game could even have a story built into it. Or, at least, it would be trending toward that direction.

+1 from me.
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  #343  
Old 05-11-2017, 06:58 PM
Ghost Matter Ghost Matter is offline
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Thanks! Unfortunately, I'm not sure we could see this in the next expansion depending on the stage where it's at.

With procedural generation, there is a story (aside from the great lore in the Soldak games), it's called (I think) an emerging story where the players make their own story. The story we'd make would be our own, depending on what the game has given us.

At the very least, I'd love more control over the region of the world where we currently are, like settling new towns after clearing them or expanding with new exits.
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  #344  
Old 05-13-2017, 08:16 PM
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Destro* Destro* is offline
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Just a bug or perhaps undocumented feature. Fire ward gives minor fire imbued, which gives 100% fire resistance, 50-100% fire damage on hit and fire damage dealt aura. In other words, it's really good and probably unintentionally so.

Also, fire ward description says that it gives 50% fire resistance base + 10% a level when it actually gives 10% base +10% a level. Probably just a typo.

I'll also note here that Unique6 monsters (warboss rank) have a 1.0 times health multiplier instead of 11. Also probably a typo.

Edit as of 5/20/2017:

A few more Qol Suggestions that I think would be good in Zombasite, and some may have a good chance to be good suggestions in Hardcore!:
- Right-click item to unequip.
- Shields should have some kind of visible display (Always wanted this.) (Perhaps when you have a shield, your health gets a grey colored bar to overlay the green colored health bar? And, if you go beyond your health capacity with a shield, then maybe it could be a 'glowing grey'. Hovering over the health bar shows your health and current shield.) (Would also be good to see how much HP enemies have.)
- Ability to see percent chance to hit with skills. (To see % accuracy bonuses that apply to skills. Perhaps in other stats?)
- In the clan info screen, to the right (or left, or somewhere else) of each persons name could be a button with a + sign or minus sign to add/remove people from your party quickly. I like the idea of an 'x' button there as well to kick people.
- Game setting to see at least to 1 or 2 decimal points on percentages. (Like max resist % doesn't show decimal amounts).
- Mod setting to have weapon speed reduce the cast time of attack skills. (Pretty please ^^) - (I finally realized a while back why Fire Strike is so OP and why cast speed works on it, but not other attack skills. It's because it is considered a spell as well. Jesus.)

5/21 suggestion: This one goes for hardcore. Add a dash skill to the next game! :O

Last edited by Destro* : 05-21-2017 at 03:31 PM.
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  #345  
Old 06-10-2017, 11:40 AM
Throwback Throwback is offline
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As I've said before, every time I come back to the game something drives me away.

This time my issue is the map. On a new character, 2 or 3 levels between monsters can make all the difference.

I came a cross an odd situation where the next zone of the map (level-wise) could only be reached by going backwards - ie by going into a higher level zone then finding the entrance to the 'earlier' map. There was no entrance from the lower level area, and both sides were blocked off even though they had other factions in them.

What made it worse was an absolute *glut* of quests in the higher level area - upwards of 20. I could not get through on a level 6 character, and lost 2 or 3 followers despite portal dancing before quitting in disgust. My main issue was a mercenary using a 2-hander who stunned me and my crew almost every hit. Putting him in a swarm of enemies in zombasite's typically crowded maps was a genuinely painful, unfun experience.

My 2c.
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  #346  
Old 06-10-2017, 12:34 PM
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@Throwback

"I came a cross an odd situation where the next zone of the map (level-wise) could only be reached by going backwards - ie by going into a higher level zone then finding the entrance to the 'earlier' map. There was no entrance from the lower level area, and both sides were blocked off even though they had other factions in them. "

There is a setting on the "Set Up Area" screen called "All Levels Connected". I recommend enabling it to address this issue.

"What made it worse was an absolute *glut* of quests in the higher level area - upwards of 20. I could not get through on a level 6 character, and lost 2 or 3 followers despite portal dancing before quitting in disgust."

I personally just turn in quests as they are completed. I never really aspire to complete any particular quest unless I have a very specific reason (like the humanoid group quests, boss groups, and arch-nem that all give massive exp). If you run around killing things at random, you will complete enough to level up anyway.

"My main issue was a mercenary using a 2-hander who stunned me and my crew almost every hit. Putting him in a swarm of enemies in zombasite's typically crowded maps was a genuinely painful, unfun experience."

1.) I recommend being at least an equal level while having decent clear speed and survivability on regular monsters before challenging humanoid monsters if you're having trouble killing them.
2.) If you're getting stunlocked and can't run, you can use your teleport stone or log off and pick a new area for a quick escape if you get stun-locked.
3.) Also, I recommend binding pause to your s key or something. Very useful for giving you extra time to react.
4.) You can always try picking a ranged class and kiting. Every melee monster in the game is kitable to the extent that they will never be able to hit you. (well in the late game you might need some ms and cast speed, etc. to keep up, but I think you get my point.) Ranged is pretty OP.
5.) Indeed, the humanoid characters are harder than normal mobs on average. And, you may not always be confident that you can kill them and may decide to avoid them. But, because you have learned from your death just now, you are now far more prepared to succeed in the future!

Trust me, these early game humanoids are cake compared to the truly BS versions that you meet late game *cough* Sorcerer *cough*.

In any case, best of luck on future runs if you do try again. Also, you may want to check out my mod (shameless advertising, also warning its in alpha) at some time if you don't want to give up on the game, but don't think the current design is balanced enough for you.
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  #347  
Old 06-10-2017, 09:05 PM
Throwback Throwback is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Destro* View Post
1.) I recommend being at least an equal level while having decent clear speed and survivability on regular monsters before challenging humanoid monsters if you're having trouble killing them.
2.) If you're getting stunlocked and can't run, you can use your teleport stone or log off and pick a new area for a quick escape if you get stun-locked.
3.) Also, I recommend binding pause to your s key or something. Very useful for giving you extra time to react.
4.) You can always try picking a ranged class and kiting. Every melee monster in the game is kitable to the extent that they will never be able to hit you. (well in the late game you might need some ms and cast speed, etc. to keep up, but I think you get my point.) Ranged is pretty OP.
5.) Indeed, the humanoid characters are harder than normal mobs on average. And, you may not always be confident that you can kill them and may decide to avoid them. But, because you have learned from your death just now, you are now far more prepared to succeed in the future!

Trust me, these early game humanoids are cake compared to the truly BS versions that you meet late game *cough* Sorcerer *cough*.

In any case, best of luck on future runs if you do try again. Also, you may want to check out my mod (shameless advertising, also warning its in alpha) at some time if you don't want to give up on the game, but don't think the current design is balanced enough for you.
I've got 190 hours in the game, finished diablo 1, diablo 2 and played hundreds of hours in PoE. I know what I'm doing when it comes to combat (builds in this game are a different story...). I was portal-dancing for quite a long time before I tried to run past this particular mob, as doing 1 hit, portal then 20+ seconds to regen all my health (or my follower's health) is stupidly tedious. The ability to get through badly designed situations by cheesing the game is hardly a plus. I have so many other great games that it's not worth it for me to do that.

if I can't get to an area without going through a higher level zone, that's a problem - especially at very low levels when it makes a huge difference. I agree I could have grinded (ground?) an empty town to get a higher level, but killing monsters for XP without quests is a very slow way to level. As I said above, that's not a fun way to play. I don't mind if I can't get to an area directly - it's frustrating but also rewarding when you do finally get there. That's why I don't have the 'all areas connected option turned on. The issue is when I have to backtrack to get to an area - that's a design/code issue. Tbh I might just turn the all areas connected option on as suggested.

I would have loved to be an even level with the mercenary I was fighting. Due to the above, he was 3 levels higher than me.

Ranged being stronger than melee is a real problem, I agree. They get more gear slots and need less resistances, they take way less damage and are simply better.

tl; dr: I *can* get through a bad situation by deliberately playing in an extremely boring way. But if I have to play that way, I don't want to play at all.

Last edited by Throwback : 06-10-2017 at 09:09 PM.
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  #348  
Old 06-11-2017, 08:05 AM
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Destro* Destro* is offline
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Meh, don't shoot the messenger. You are dissatisfied with the game, so I'm just offering advice to help you enjoy the game. That gaming experience that you are boasting about clearly isn't helping you to enjoy the game. So, I'm hoping that my advice will. What you do with it is up to you.

For quests, if you're running low, then just reroll a new area to get new quests. As for not being able to reach higher level quests, just reroll to a higher area level and they will spawn right outside of your clan. There is no experience penalty in non-hardcore, so your problems will be solved very effectively.

As for cheesy tactics, I'm sure you're aware of the whole 'ethical SSF' meme in PoE. If it works, use it. Though, I do agree that the vanilla game advocates too much cheese, which was a driving force behind me making my mod.

I hope things work out better for you some day! Zombasite is a really great game once you get past the level 20-30 bottleneck. And, the Scavanger trait is like a headhunter on steroids. Its a lot of fun. GL!
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  #349  
Old 06-11-2017, 10:45 AM
Throwback Throwback is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Destro* View Post
Meh, don't shoot the messenger. You are dissatisfied with the game, so I'm just offering advice to help you enjoy the game. That gaming experience that you are boasting about clearly isn't helping you to enjoy the game. So, I'm hoping that my advice will. What you do with it is up to you.

For quests, if you're running low, then just reroll a new area to get new quests. As for not being able to reach higher level quests, just reroll to a higher area level and they will spawn right outside of your clan. There is no experience penalty in non-hardcore, so your problems will be solved very effectively.

As for cheesy tactics, I'm sure you're aware of the whole 'ethical SSF' meme in PoE. If it works, use it. Though, I do agree that the vanilla game advocates too much cheese, which was a driving force behind me making my mod.

I hope things work out better for you some day! Zombasite is a really great game once you get past the level 20-30 bottleneck. And, the Scavanger trait is like a headhunter on steroids. Its a lot of fun. GL!
Just responding for fun here - I'm not mad, there's no ill-will

1. Not a boast, I know there are a lot of people with thousands of hours more experience in ARPG than me. I simply get a bit funny when I think people are accusing me of not knowing what I'm doing. I guess I have a chip on my shoulder.

2. At the end of the day, everyone sets a limit to how much 'cheese' they will use, in every walk of life. You probably don't commit every crime that you can get away with and would give you an advantage in life, for example. I actually started portal dancing, before hitting the point of it being too tedious. The game simply shouldn't put me in that situation.

3. I really like this game. I have never played another game that feels as much like you are in a living, breathing world as this one. However, the game is just so complex that I always come across something which makes me nope out of the game. A short and very incomplete list: bad level situations as per the latest; unreachable areas (due to distance and level) spawning constant base attacks from the beginning of the game; melee not being able to afford weapon upgrades due to repair costs (relative to ranged); acid and poison being shitty mechanics in a game with limited movement space; giant uniques taking up all the screen real estate so you can't run even if you want to; two-handers being clearly better than 1-handers and having many more viable builds (at least for warrior, haven't played death knight); NPC deaths causing insanity chain reactions....

Again - I love the game which is why I have 190 hours in it.

Last edited by Throwback : 06-11-2017 at 10:51 AM.
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  #350  
Old 06-11-2017, 10:50 AM
Tiamat Tiamat is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Throwback View Post
A short and very incomplete list: bad level situations as per the latest; unreachable areas (due to distance and level) spawning constant base attacks from the beginning of the game; melee not being able to afford weapon upgrades due to repair costs (relative to ranged); acid and poison being shitty mechanics in a game with limited movement space; giant uniques taking up all the screen real estate so you can't run even if you want to; two-handers being clearly better than 1-handers and having many more viable builds; NPC deaths causing insanity chain reactions....
There's an option whenever you roll up a new map to "connect every area" or something like that. Once you select that, every area will always be connected to the adjacent area, which means there should never be a situation where you have to loop-de-loop around the high level areas to reach an otherwise unaccessible low-level area (to do a quest there or whatever other reason you want to go there). At least when the feature works. It's been buggy sometimes but I haven't played in a while (waiting for the expansion) so I don't know how well it works now.

For NPC insanity chain reactions, I play the game in what I dub "super-softcore mode". You basically constantly make back-ups of your character's data file and copy those to an alternate folder so that whenever something particularly crazy destroys you or your clan, you can just copy one of those back-ups over your ruined character's data and start from an earlier point. Basically it's save-scumming except since Zombasite auto-saves, you have to do the save-file back-ups manually yourself. Whether or not that's cheesy or cheating is up to you, but no one else ever has to know because this is an offline game (unless you're playing multiplayer for some reason, in which case I'm not sure save-scumming back-up copying even works anyways). Me, if I wanted to play a game where everything I earned could be destroyed in a single moment, I would have chosen to play hard-core mode. But I didn't. I chose not-hard-core, so I'm not going to let myself get permanently punished for something if I can help it (otherwise I would have chosen hard-core!), at least not in an offline game (for an online game, you gotta have things be fair. Though I'd likely just not play that game in the first place in that case)

Last edited by Tiamat : 06-11-2017 at 10:55 AM.
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